Mattress Forum

Hi guy. did you ask what you said you would ask from shawn at sleepez. - did you test out 14-16 ILD dunlop latex? Thanks.

Xfirm as base layer

Then firm

then medium

then soft dunlop as top layer?

Does shawn gives this recomendation to everyone?

http://www.whatsthebest-mattress.com/forum/sleepez-soft-dunlop-ild-gone-down/18218-0-1.html

read this thread guy. Youy promised you would look into it when you visit SleepEz.

Thanks.
 

True. Some people feel that latex "pushes back" too much. I used to be one of them, and probably still would say that on an all-latex mattress.

Now I sleep on a Dunlop 3" piece and 2 Talalay 1" toppers (one is actually 1.5"). But the whole thing on top of a springy type support.

For awhile I was using a Sealy and then an Englander springs for support.

Now I am using an IKEA Sultan bowed-wood support system and it is actually better for me than the inner springs. Though I wonder if it might be starting to "wear in" too much (or wear out)... My next step will be to try some sort of adjustable slatted-wood platform for it.

YES, Latex has a lot of pushback...

And then you have to exchange layers.

Read the posts in the forum.  People want to jump to buy latex but after they have the bed they all are saying it is not comfortable and that they are having pains in this body part or that body part..

Latex seems to be like a mirage in the desert that a thirsty man thinks is the real water but it seems like most people are not happy about their latex beds.

xyz1ab wrote:
"Latex seems to be like a mirage in the desert that a thirsty man thinks is the real water but it seems like most people are not happy about their latex beds."

I think that is an exaggeration of the facts at best.

Latex works for MANY people on this forum, and I'd say those who have tried it and don't like it are in the minority.

Some find that latex alone is not comfortable but some find that latex on top of springs is very comfortable. Many find that pure latex is comfortable. Sometimes one needs to add a layer of wool or visco on top or near the top to counteract the "push back" feeling of latex.

But to say that most people are not happy with their latex beds is simply not true, imho, based on years of participation in this forum.
 

You have 1047 posts! and have you found the ideal latex?

Just asking.

Yes, I am the "king of all nuts" here at the forum in a way because I have spent so much time experimenting with foams and DIY projects. It's been both a hobby and experimentation born out of necessity. My posts # is due to my having been here a long time more than posting often. Though admittedly I do go through spurts of posting often. I find the idea of creating my own mattress fascinating and this grew out of trying a number of other mattresses - including all latex and all foam, including Tempurpedic, and various "S Co" spring mattresses as well - and finding that none of them gave me a good night's sleep. (I have been in 4 car accidents which gave me neck back and shoulder problems. I always like to point out that I was hit from behind every time and none of them were my fault. ) Yes, I believe I have found close to the ideal latex.

I spent a long time experimenting with memory foam and finally came to the conclusion that it is the worst type of foam to put in a mattress. I tried it in combination with latex. I was sold on the "idea" of memory foam so kept searching for the right one. After trying 2, 3, 4 and 5lb density memory foam I gave up on it after some years. I now use NO memory foam. I know some do like it and more power to them. But for me it was a bust. I hate the stuff. Though I admit I am intrigued by 6 and 7lb memory foam and would like to try it!

As to the perfect latex, this is an easy thing for some to figure out and harder for others. And it's all relative and objective.

I have not had the $$ to try every latex I would like to try but I've tried many including a flobeds experiment with various layers over 2 months or whatever it was before I returned it. I admire and respect the fact that flobeds offers this excellent return policy and I was very happy with their company but the mattress simply did not work for me. I wish it had.

Of the mattresses I have tried, Tempurpedic was the worst. I do not recommend it for people with back problems. It felt GREAT the first few nights then deteriorated rapidly as it softened up. This is their main problem: their foam softens too much too quickly and based too much on ambient temperature. I hear it is also loaded with formaldehyde though I have not confirmed that. Budgy - can you answer this?

Now back to your question: DId I find the perfect latex?

Yes and no.

I am using a base of 2" of 32ILD dunlop topped by a 1.5" mystery talalay layer that may be Talatech 28-32ILD and a top layer of 2" natural 32ILD Talalay. That has given me more rest than any other thing I have tried in the 10 years or so I've been experimenting.

However I have it on top of a bowed wood base and as I expected, the bowed wood is getting softer and not providing the kind of support it did. Thus I am looking for a new adjustable base. I also have a hankering to try a pocket coil mattress so may do that when I get the $$. Chances are, if I do, I'll end up using latex in it.

But my point in all this is that yes, latex works for a LOT of people, with or without springs. I have tried HR, HD and other foams in various ILD's - and latex has worked the best, though I do require a springy base under it. Some do like it as is, just pure latex, but not me.

We are currently sleeping on a king size, 4 inch, B F Goodrich, TexFoam, 100% Rubber Latex Foam, Extra Firm mattress. The label states that is is 31 - 37 lbs. Certified Compression. We bought that mattress 47 years ago because I was having severe back problems. My husband made the platform for the mattress from plywood.  There has been no distortion in the mattress we currently own.

It is starting to dry out and get hard on the edges. Also we are in our 70's now and have a bit of pressure discomfort. My husband raised the head of the bed about 3 1/2 inches with plywood to help my acid reflux, which causes the ticking on the cover to slide down, which is not only annoying, we are concerned that it will wear out.

We both have back, shoulder and other sleep problems now, so are looking for something a bit softer, but with the firmness we need for our backs. 

I am interested in the Tranquility with two 3" layers of foam from Savvy Rest, because we don't want a mattress that makes the bed too difficult to make or tall to get in and out of easily, but when I spoke to Savvy Rest, they said the Tranquility is not recommended for adults, only children. We both weigh under 150 lbs, but since we've been sleeping on the 4 inch mattress, we think that would suit us. But I am concerned about slippage between the two mattresses, especially since we have the head of the bed raised and have slippage problems now. I am also wondering if the foam will wear out more quickly with that crease where the bed is raised.

We are traveling to Ashville, North Carolina to test the Savvy Rest mattress in a few weeks, but I am concerned about the warranty on the mattress which Savvy Rest stated would be 20 years. I asked if they would abide by the warranty and she stated that they would if there were more than an inch of a depression.

This scares the dickens out of me since it seems there is no returning the mattress and even if you could, the expense of shipping is astronomical! I am extremely concerned about the possibility that we will not like the new mattress or it will be uncomfortable, then we will be stuck with an expensive albatross around our necks.

I have researched mattresses locally, even going back to the store where we purchased our original mattress, to no avail. There is no "natural" latex available here in the Louisville, Ky area. There are other types of latex to be had, but they are not natural.

So, Jimsocal, could you please tell me where you purchased the foam. And would a plywood foundation work for with the latex made today.

Thanks for any help you can give me.

You don't have to say anything to him but what works for some people may not work for all.  There are doctors who will tell you anything....that doesn't make them right.  Maybe your doctor doesn't need back support for his back...my grandson doesn't either, but I wouldn't take his recommendation on a mattress.  I'm not expert or doctor, but I doubt they study mattresses or mattress structure in medical school.

Thanks for your reply, but we are pretty sure we don't want Tempurpedic, after much research. I think we are down to latex, just don't know where to go from here, except to try Savvy Rest.

A while ago I went into one of those box mattress stores and tried out a Tempurpedic.  It was like sleeping in sand.  I liked the feeling!  But it's environmentally evil, hot and since you sink into the mattress tossing and turning (which I do a lot of) doesn't work.  So I've been leaning toward latex which is about the same price.

I went to Reclaim Home who has on display Savvy Rest 10" mattresses in Dunlop and Talalay.  I liked what I saw and sent about 30 minutes trying out different combos.  I tried the default configs of F/F/M and M/M/S in Dunlop and Talalay.  I couldn't tell much difference between the Dunlop and Talalay in the F/F/M.  I sleep half way between side and stomach and sometimes sleep on stomach and on side.  The F/F/M didn't have any softness to it, but I liked the firmness.  The M/M/S was nice and cushy and the Talalay felt softer than the Dunlop.  I think the Talalay soft is softer than the Dunlop soft FWIW.

I had them put F/F/S in Dunlop and it felt just right.  There was enough cushioning when sleeping on my side and enough support so that my midsection didn't sag when sleeping on my stomach.  If I decide to purchase, I'll go back and try a F/M/S for comparison.  I liked the feel of latex.  The wool layer on top is pretty thin about 0.5 in, and the cover had a heavy brass zipper.  The overall quality seemed reasonable to me.  The store had the 2x1/2 width latex beds in queen so that they had two of each F/M/S layers.  I could definitely feel the seam.

Then I went to McRoskey, just to see what all that talk is about.  I walked in with my mind made up that there were no springs in my future!  Prices are similar for *mattress only*.  The McRoskey Classic without a box spring had a similar feel to the latex: solid, firm base with a cushion layer on top.  I would not have guessed there were coils in that bed.  Then I tried the fancy, expensive one; it has coils, surrounded by organic wool (the salesman said 50lbs!) and 1" latex (I didn't ask which kind) on both outer sides.  The mattress is flippable and rotatable.  I THOUGHT I HAD DIED AND GONE TO HEAVEN!!!!!!  But the price is $4k.  The saleman at McRoskey was very helpful, not pushy at all.  Even though they don't have a lot of different mattresses, they had a large display.

I also stopped at the Natural Mattress Store.  I walked in to an empty store and the salesman never got up.  I had to ask if they had any all latex mattresses in the store.  The mattressees weren't well labelled.  I started laying on them figuring he might walk over and help, but he didn't get up.  I didn't find any zippers to unzip to look inside.  I tried out a few and then left.  I was disappointed.

The Savvy Rest Serenity looks like a decent quality product.  The funky McRoskey mattress was a pleasant surprise.  If you have a store in your area that sells custom-made, high end mattresses, you should at least try them out.

YMMV

Firstly, you may get more responses if you post your question in a new topic thread, rather than under this current, unrelated thread topic.  Nevertheless, I'll provide my 2 cents here and we'll see if others chime in...

Wow - 47 years is quite a run for a mattress!

Many folks on this forum have purchased their latex mattresses through online vendors.  Both www.sleepez.com and www.flobeds.com sell all natural latex mattresses in a variety of configurations, and both have received largely positive reviews on this site. Both vendors also offer "layer exchanges", as well as a 90 - 100 day full money back guarantees, which provides peace of mind if you decide you don't like the mattress within the first few months and want to return it. Even if you decide to purchase a mattress online, however, it's generally advised to test a few latex mattresses out in a store to help guide your purchasing decision, by helping you determine what configuration, thickness, and latex firmness ("ILD") suits you best. So a trip to a nearby Savvy Rest is still a good idea, even if you don't ultimately purchase from them. The type of latex being manufactured today, offered by Savvy Rest and others, will probably feel quite different than your Goodrich TexFoam mattress.

Another option you might consider is to purchase a soft "topper" to go on your existing latex mattress.  It sounds as though you are considering getting a new mattress not because your old mattress has deteriorated in support, but rather because you have reached a point where you would like some additional cushioning to go along with that support.  This might be achieved simply by getting a softer layer of foam to go on top or your mattress, which would of course be a lot more economical than buying an entirely new mattress. In addition to the online vendors listed above, www.sleeplikeabear.com offers latex "toppers" for this purpose. I would suggest a topper layer that is around 2" thick, in the 14-19 ILD range. You might also ask your Savvy Rest store about what they offer for toppers.

I wouldn't worry too much about slippage between layers. Many folks place multi-layered latex mattresses on adjustable beds, with upper and lower body sections that raise and lower, and I don't think slippage is generally much a problem there.

Good luck with your search!

Thank you so much for your reply and especially referring to our Goodrich Mattress. I was hoping someone would compare it to the latex manufactured today. When you say it is "different", do you mean in terms of durability or firmness? Our current mattress is starting to crumble a little, but only on the edges. We are lucky in the fact that there are grips on the sides of the mattress ticking to turn it so we don't have to touch the latex itself. I was considering a topper for this mattress, but thought since it was beginning to crumble, we should buy a new one. Also, when I was considering a purchase of a new mattress, I was thinking that our son could use the new one after we are gone, but hopefully that will not be for many more years. :) 

Wish the Savvy Rest store were closer than 300 miles, but we hope to make it a bit of a vacation trip too. Still it would be nice to be able to try a mattress more than once. I am also going to call around to see what is available locally one more time, but think there are slim pickings around here.

I did take your advice to post under a new topic.

Sleepwithcats,

Thanks so much for your review on Savvy Rest. I only wish that we were that close to a SR store, or any store which sells some other latex besides Tempurpedic, which we have tried, find it too soft and are concerned about being too warm.

Are you planning to buy a new mattress?

I know a poster on the decorating forum who posted about how Savvy Rest latex bed in 2007 and I know she is happy. I went with FloBeds.com since I wanted to be able to return the bed and get a refund if an all latex bed was not for me. I also was told about FloBeds from tax customers of mine and when I went on the website, I was impressed and called Dave.  Any Latex bed that has the layers set up for your individual needs I feel you and your wife will be happy with.  I myself like very firm latex layers with no soft layers but a 1" latex topper being that I am not quite 5 feet tall and only 100 lbs.  Most small adults seem to like softer beds but to me, I need a firm bed with a tiny bit of cushion for pressure relief.

Good luck with your search for a new bed.

Well, I'm sure there must be some people who allergic to sleeping on latex but then there are some people who allergic to everything. If you're allergic to sleeping on latex, don't sleep on it. However being allergic to wearing latex gloves, for example, does not preclude you from sleeping on latex. It's a completely different situation.

I bought my latex at various places and created my own mattress but if you want an all latex mattress with no springs then I recommend flobeds, especially since you are concerned about spending money and ending up with an "albatross".

I know this is an old post, but when people come across this I do want them to realize this is completely false statement. Latex does not push back against you any more than any other foam. Actualy Latex, HD Foam, Memory foam, Visco foam, etc... All push back against you with exactly the same force and it doesnt matter what density or compression ratio the foam is. They all push back against you with exactly the same force. The amount of force is determined by gravity. if you put 50lbs on top of any of those foams they will all sink until it has 50lbs pressure pushing back. and it works the same with all weights. Once it has 50lbs pressure pushing back you will stop sinking. How far you sink will depend on the compression ratio of the foam (ILD)

Push back for latex is a term created by poly foam manufactures to make their foam sound better and is just simply a false statement.

A way to test it. Take memory foam of 30ILD and take latex of 30ILD and apply 30 pounds per sq inch of pressure. If they both sink 1" then they have the same pushback.

I'm glad to hear you love your flobed. I'm patiently wait the arrival of mine.

Just to let anyone reading this know, Latex International now makes the super firm in 100% natural talalay. I just ordered my new flobed with a layer of super firm in 100% natural.

1.  they cover their latex with too much junk

2.  assume latex is a magical foam that lasts forever

3.  get too soft/firm latex without enough support/conformation

I get what the OP's talking about re: "pushback" though. It's definitely a different sensation than with other foams, especially memory foam.  For instance one's shoulders & hips might find the same depth in two given latex & MF layers, but the foam in between the shoulder & hip points that "rises" into the curve of your body will feel different- all MF needs to soften is exposure to heat, so if you sink just enough for the arch of your back to just touch that foam in between, you won't feel that same bubble like pressure into the arch of your back the same way you might with some latex, even if your hips & shoulders are sinking the same amount.  Latex does not back down from heat alone.  Not everyone likes that sensation, but it can be controlled with the right firmness or gradations of firmness, without losing its support.

I do like that bubble of pressure sensation though.  It's exactly the type of support I find my back needs.

actually what you are saying is completely untruthful. I have tried 3 latex beds. latex has tremendous amount of pushback. Soft latex too. lie on a latex bed and within short time it begins to pushback against you. Presses against your body in such a hard way that is really hurtful and very uncomfortable.  Very uncomfortable sensation. The pressing or pushback of a foam is completely different then pushback of a latex mattress.

exactly. tempurpedics have this problem too hence lack of support. Pressure relief yes but support no.

IN latex it is opposite. Support yes BUT pressure relief - I say no. I also say that latex pushback is in fact counter to pressure relief.

hence the conundrum.

tempurpedics and latex have big disadvantages.

 

I dont think people are allergic to latex. I think some people are allergic to residues of substances which are used to process the latex

Most people agree that traditional poly foams are good for pressure relief. Don't they push back as much as latex? So if they are good for relief then shouldn't latex be too?