Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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Would love to hear opinions about the Simmons NxG 250 firm? Would I be able to add a topper, (latex or foam) to this type of bed if the NxG foam where to break down prematurely OR just to change the feel if I didn't like it? Your replies are very much appreciated :-) Natalie PS. I have really tried to research this bed. Have read through the older posts (not very many on this bed) here, almost all good reviews at Macy's and US Mattress, one bad at Viewpoints, none at epinions, so please don't think I'm not also doing my own research. Of course none of the reviews say if you can add a topper later, so I'm posting it here. Specs from US Mattress: Comfort Quilt - Top of Mattress Comfort - Padding Layers Mattress Build-Out Correct Back Support System Foundation Mattress Set Height Information Warranty This message was modified Feb 10, 2010 by Natalia
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Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
| You can always add a topper, but if the foam underneath the NXG material breaks down (there is still standard PU foam used underneath the NXG layer) then the topper will only mask the issue and will probably not remove body indentations. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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I tried this bed when I was mattress shopping and found it unbelievably comfortable - actually, I think I tried 1 model up - an NXG 450 or something like that. Nevertheless, I didn't buy it because of what Budgy just said - if there is PU foam in there, it will break down, and within a matter of a few months or years. However, I have to say that it was one of the most pleasurable mattresses I've tried. If I had confidence it would last, I would have bought it. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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budgy wrote: You can always add a topper, but if the foam underneath the NXG material breaks down (there is still standard PU foam used underneath the NXG layer) then the topper will only mask the issue and will probably not remove body indentations. budgy, you are a fount of knowledge! I only wish you could be cloned and placed in each of the mattress stores in my area  . I'm grateful for all your replies on this forum.Natalie |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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KimberlyH wrote: I tried this bed when I was mattress shopping and found it unbelievably comfortable - actually, I think I tried 1 model up - an NXG 450 or something like that. Nevertheless, I didn't buy it because of what Budgy just said - if there is PU foam in there, it will break down, and within a matter of a few months or years. However, I have to say that it was one of the most pleasurable mattresses I've tried. If I had confidence it would last, I would have bought it. KimberlyH, I agree totally! This bed, especially in the 400 line, feels like heaven! But if I trade in my TP Cloud Supreme, I can only do it once so I'm researching this Simmons Nxg and the TP Rhapsody, along with a few distant others. I feel a kinship to you as we both suffer from the tingling, burning, painful hips problem. Others think I'm nuts and too over sensitive but I know my own pain. Let me say I am soooo glad you found a mattress that has helped you! (YAY!) BTW, you had suggested on another of my posts on building my own latex bed from Flobeds, or Sleepez and I forgot to tell you why I don't. I understand the layers are heavy and difficult for one person to handle and I have physical limitations. Though I could probably get my son to take a trip to visit and help me once, if it were to involved any returns and adjustments, his work schedule and expense of travel would be too much to ask. So, either a TP, or a pre-built store brand that a topper can be added to will have to do. All I can do is research, research, research. Thank you for all your help. I hope someday I can post something useful and help someone too! Natalie |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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Natalia wrote: budgy, you are a fount of knowledge! I only wish you could be cloned and placed in each of the mattress stores in my area . I'm grateful for all your replies on this forum.Natalie Quoted for flattery :) Thank you |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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If Natalia bought the Simmons and if the foam wears out (okay it will wear out) and she does mattress surgery where is the fire retardants in the new beds nowadays? That is a question I wondered if some of them use boric acid powder or some kind of chemical and you don't know it when it open it yikes. Budgy can you address (please) which beds have what "stuff" in it for fire retardants requirements. I would want to know it only have wool in it before I did mattress surgery. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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realistically all mattress coverings and sometimes fibre layers underneath the covers are treated with something. Boric acid is typically only used in cotton batting. Polyester outer mattress coverings are treated with formaldehyde. Formaldehyde is very soluble in water and they basically just spray the covers down with it. If you want a mattress that is basically guaranteed not to have chemical flame retardants you want it certified by Eco Institut (the whole mattress, not just the latex, or whatever filling materials are used). They have a strict tolerance of less than 20mg of formaldehyde per cubic metre of batting material, if formaldehyde was required to make the mattress pass the fire safety test it would likely spike to a level easily 100 times over this amount. Another interesting thing about wool being used as a chemical fire retardant. I found a manufacturers website claiming wool doesn't allow a bed to pass these new requirements (because wool still burns). Wool alone CAN pass the requirements, but you need to use a fair bit of it. All mattress (even treated with chemicals) will still go up in flames, they just have to take a certain amount of time before they are completely engulfed in flames. One thing to keep in mind is that large scale manufacturing facilities are usually designed with quilting machines that can run up to 400m of fabric an hour because they need to churn out hundreds of mattresses a day. When these companies put wool (or silk) in a quilted layer it is in very small amounts because those fibres interfere with the way these quilted machines work. I have seen the way these machines work first hand compared to say the way an all wool quilted panel is done. They basically have to send the carded wool and fabric layers into the quilting machine by hand (hand feed) and they really have to take their time to insure the job is done correctly, these types of machines will run at about 40m of fabric an hour because they have to be much more careful and they are going through usually very thick wool piling. Basically what I am getting at is that major companies simply cannot put this amount of wool into their beds, not even close to enough to use it as a flame retardant, especially when its all mixed with polyester (which is basically made from hydrocarbons and burns very easily). So they would all have those polyester layers treated with something as well as the cover. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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Thanks Budgy for that info. Are some mattress companies more free with the boric acid than others? The formaldehyde in the mattress top is that labeled on the tag? Do all manufacturers do this to your knowledge? I do not want formaldehyde on my mattress. You are saying they have done this before the law required them to for fire retardant reasons? What can consumers do to get more information on this? I tried to read manufacturers websites, but you know they are not real forthcoming with information even on what is in those mattresses. Particularly even when they put latex in them, they don't even tell you what ILD, or firm, or soft. Do customers you have ask about this, or do they just blindly buy and not care? I for one never wanted this law passed. I don't smoke, and I have a fire alarm system with a phone I can call 911  . Government passes stupid laws sometimes. Don't we have enough chemicals in our life? Getting off my soap box now.Why can't they just lay the wool over the mattress before they make their mattress cover with stitching? I for one don't like their machine quilting with foam sewn it, it makes it bumpy and uncomfortable. Gripe, gripe, gripe. If I could only make my own mattress from scratch. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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wool in large amounts not being quilted properly = lumps (not to mention still too costly for most big brands to implement). no, unfortunately these things will not be listed on the law label tag in this kind of detail. only what the upholstery is made of, and usually fabric content as well. As for has this been done even before the laws got tighter? I think its been done in limited amounts for quite some time, there havebeen fire safety laws for mattresses for quite some time, they are just now much tougher to pass without resorting to chemical flame retardants to keep the cost reasonable. Realistically the only way you can know for sure that you would not have any chemical flame retardants is to buy something certified organic, or atleast all natural with wool being used as a fire barrier. Or even better than that is to buy from a manufacturer that ONLY builds organic, because then there is also zero chance of cross contamination. And if you don't like wool for whatever reason (maybe allergy concerns) you can get some manufacturers to build you a bed without wool and without chemical flame retardants given you have a prescription. This message was modified Feb 11, 2010 by budgy
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Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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Don't forget ripoffreport.com Also, I saw what consumer reports said was a really good bed........ How much is that Simmons? Have you read if Simmons honors it's warented products? That seems to be the #1 thing the admn harp on. Can you take it back if you don't like it? Alice |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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I'm really not sure if its common practice in the US or not, but I would assume most places you buy that type of bed from would not just simply return it, there would be some type of comfort exchange priveleges though. Really the only places that should have an actual refund policy are going to be either internet only retailers and places like Costco because you cannot really try out the bed at all before you buy. My policy is absolutely not to do a 100% refund, unless of course we have exhausted all our options and we know before we do an exchange that the customer just wants to be unhappy. I have only refunded one mattress myself. Regarding Simmons on warranty issues I think it really depends on who is doing the warranty inspection, all the reps on that product in my area are very forgiving. I have seen more than a handful of beds get warrantied that they really didn't even have to. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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fantasticalice wrote: Don't forget ripoffreport.com Also, I saw what consumer reports said was a really good bed........ How much is that Simmons? Have you read if Simmons honors it's warented products? That seems to be the #1 thing the admn harp on. Can you take it back if you don't like it? Alice fantasticalice, I don't have access to consumer reports. Sale prices: The 250 NxG is around 2000.00 for the set, 1600.00 for the mattress only. I have an Ergo Motion Adjustable foundation, so I'm looking at mattress only. The 400 NxG is around 2500.00 for the set, 2000.00 for the mattress only. I personally have a one time comfort exchange on my currant TP Cloud, so this would it for me. Or I could get my money back and go somewhere else, but Sleep Train does have this Simmons and so far have they've been great to deal with. For first time buyers, Sleep Train in CA has a 100 night try out. Then you can either get a full refund or do a one time exchange. Other mattress stores in my area, only offer the one time comfort exchange. 14 Simmons complaints on Ripoff.com Note: No Rip off reports on Tempurpedic, but I have read of claims denied on other forums. Mostly because TP does not warranty against the bed getting softer. And of course over time they do get a lot softer. They do however cover any visible indention of 1/2" or deeper. And stains DO NOT void the warranty. Simmons Warranty: (on this bed 10 year) This warranty does not apply to: • Firmness preference of the product • Normal body impression(s) of 1 1/2" or less** • Bed height • Cover (fabric) • Bent border/grid wires ---- Okay, this one bothers me---- • Burns, stains or soil • Mattresses not used with a proper foundation (see (i) and (ii) on following page) • Merchandise sold “as-is”, “distressed” or “floor model” • Adjustable foundations (see the owner’s manual for details) • For HealthSmart™ models, damage due to improper washing (including snags and discoloration) • For HealthSmart™ models, shrinkage, so long as top can still be zipped on • Claims made outside the 50 United States, Puerto Rico or U.S. Virgin Islands • Transportation, inspection, or removal costs of product • Simmons product that has a manufacturing defect and is stained or soiled. For health and safety reasons, Simmons may not be able to inspect these products to assess whether covered by the warranty, in which case, Simmons reserves the right to deny warranty coverage. Thank you for the post. You really made me do even more research, which BTW, is a good thing :-) Natalie <--- learning all the time |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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Now that's what we love on this forum! Members who *do their research* *become knowledgeable* (or at least as knowledgeable as you can be in this mystifying world of mattresses) and *share informed knowledge* Keep it up! The part that worries me about this warranty is that the indentation has to be at least 1.5" for a warranty claim. My concern is the quality of the PU foam used in the base layers and how soon they will break down. I can tell you that a few years ago I bought my daughter a new mattress, and within a year there was a giant crater right in the middle of it. Fortunately she's young, not old and creaky like we are, and wouldn't hear of me replacing it. But i do want to avoid the same situation happening with my other daughter, who I'm now mattress shopping for. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
| I laid on the nx250 in the stoer for about 20 minutes, although a short time, it did appear to be very comfortable. Of course the sales person had no idea about the foam.. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
 Found this review along with a followup comment and picture posted on Viewpoints: (Hope it's okay to post it here, if not please let me know) After a back-and-forth with Simmons and Mattress Warehouse, it seems Mattress Warehouse was trying to pull a fast one by denying our warranty claim. Once Simmons saw the photos of our bulge, they stepped in and are now making MW take back our defective mattress so we can pick out a new one. Yay Simmons! The bed was/is very comfortable, so if they're saying this defect is not normal then I should expect this to NOT HAPPEN AGAIN if we pick out another Simmons mattress. The moral of this story? Don't shop at Mattress Warehouse. Here's my original review below. Sorry if this doesn't speak to the comfort of the bed, but that's entirely subjective anyway. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- After approximately 11 months, my Simmons NXG 400 mattress has developed a tumor. The edge collapsed, leaving a dip in the top and a huge bulge on the outer rim. I had a mattress inspector come to the house. The verdict? The store where I bought the mattress says this is not covered under the Simmons warranty. Apparently, when the edge of a bed fails it's not the manufacturer's responsibility. Nothing adverse has happened to this bed, other than getting in it and out of it on a nightly/daily basis. That Simmons is not standing behind their product is disappointing, but I'm not taking this lying down (no pun intended). As part of the "battle of the bulge," I am documenting my lumpy experience in numerous online forums, and also writing letters to Simmons and the mattress store. Most importantly, I hope anyone reading this thinks twice about buying ANY Simmons mattress. Although I have tried to use humor to illustrate my frustration, I assure you this is an extremely upsetting situation considering we spent over $3,000 for this spring and foam piece of junk. Comment on Review by another owner: We have the identical problem, much worse, actually, and so far, no one wants to warrant this - we have slept on this bed less than 3 months ____________________________________________ In the Simmons warranty I posted above one of the exclusions is • Bent border/grid wires. Does that pertain to this "bulge"? Natalie |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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based on this photo I am going to say no. the bent border rod thing with Simmons is really just protecting their asses on people that literally had to bend the mattress too much in order to get it to fit through a tight staircase or something. If this was caused by moving the mattress incorrectly the bend would most certainly be almost right in the middle and not near the head end of the mattress. This one is pretty clearly caused by just using the edge of the mattress, which should be covered by warranty. |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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REALLY? How it was moved......the dudes from Costco DROPPED my mattress and how they got it in my bedroom is another story! Then there's the post from the gal who says they moved the pick-up beds with the new beds. If some one has bed bugs so do you and she got em'. I am so glad I didn't get stuck with another bummer but I would of kept the $300 air bed from Costco and inside I would of put latex. Live and learn. Hoping so see a deal like that again. Alice |
Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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Sorry I haven't time to read this whole thread and maybe I already posted this... But as soon as I saw this, I thought there was a problem: " Comfort - Padding Layers Mattress Build-Out This mattress had FOUR INCHES of soft foam on top! (Look at the See what's inside this mattress" link) That alone makes this a useless mattress, imho. You can always add a topper later. The problem is that you can NOT reverse the negative effects of too-soft, non-supportive foam inside a mattress! Even the Englander I bought in "FIRM" - the firmest they had - had 3" or so of Peee-Ewww foam on top of the springs and so I had to immediately take it out and replace it with better foam! The problem with this mattress isn't that it's going to be too firm, the problem is, it's going to be too soft and/or non-supportive. IMHO. This message was modified Feb 12, 2010 by jimsocal
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Re: Simmons 250 NxG Firm question
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fantasticalice wrote: REALLY? How it was moved......the dudes from Costco DROPPED my mattress and how they got it in my bedroom is another story! Then there's the post from the gal who says they moved the pick-up beds with the new beds. If some one has bed bugs so do you and she got em'. I am so glad I didn't get stuck with another bummer but I would of kept the $300 air bed from Costco and inside I would of put latex. Live and learn. Hoping so see a deal like that again. Alice Ewww.. Alice! Bed bugs! Shouldn't have read this right before bed last night... gave me creepy-crawlies. One more thing to worry about  .After reading all the knowledgeable replies, this one has been crossed off my list. Thank you everyone, Natalie BTW, I just looked at all the mattress surgeries. Amazing to see what's really on the inside! |