| i have a sleepez bed that I keep trying to soften by adding more layers of foam in the case. So I now have 4.5 layers in a case meant for 3 layers. The case still zips, but I wonder if I am compressing the foam so much that it is affecting the feel. I have talalay latex, which always felt springy to me, but I am wondering if this made it more springy? Or if this is bad for the foam? |
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That will be an interesting comparison (medium Dunlop in the middle to medium Talalay in the middle). In theory ... assuming that the 25% ILD of the actual 3" layers you have is the same ... the Talalay should let you sink in a little more (lower sag factor). This may be just enough to give you the softness/cradle you need and still keep the alignment. This would also depend on how deeply the middle layer compressed. If it is less than 25% then the Dunlop would be a little softer. If it is more than 25% then the Talalay would be a little softer. I am guessing that you will compress it more than 25% so the Talalay may "win" the softness battle lol. This is where it would be important to "differentiate" any discomfort that came from pressure and any discomfort that came from alignment so we can tell whether "sinking in" is an issue or "sinking down" is an issue ... and of course which parts of you are doing what. Looking forward to the next "report" ... with the 1" in "reserve" (just like fine wine) :) Phoenix This message was modified Jan 11, 2011 by Phoenix
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I think the med-talalay did feel a little better than the med-dunlop. They both feel way better than what I had a month ago. Honestly I think I could keep sleeping this way without issue. But I still would prefer a more cushy "pillow-top" feel. And that extra 1" of soft talalay is calling out to me! I really want to try it! I know just adding the 1" on top of either of these last 2 configs will be too soft. So I think I need to make the stack more "differential" - firm bottom support, soft top comfort. I think that means putting the firm dunlop on top of the medium dunlop in the support part of the mattress. Then add the 1" & the 3" soft on top. Not sure if 1" over 3" soft would feel much different than 3" over 1". What would you suggest? I think its (top to bottom): 1" soft over 3" soft over 3" firm over 3" med. Seem right? |
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Yup, I'd do the same thing as you are suggesting for exactly the same reasons (firm Dunlop under the soft Talalay). The 1" over the 3" would likely be a "little" bit more comforming (thinner layers "act" a little softer) but the difference would likely be slight since they are the same ILD. Given your feedback ... I'm pretty confident you have the materials you need to get to where you want to go without zoning (and this layering may even be "it") ... even though that would still be an option if it turns out to be neccessary. Phoenix This message was modified Jan 12, 2011 by Phoenix
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Haven't actually switched yet - which is good because now I know for sure that the soft over medium talalay isn't supportive enough. Woke up at 6am today, on my back, feeling like my hips had sunk in way too much. It's odd because it doesn't feel that bad at first. Not sure if I am actually sinking in more as the night goes on or if I just feel it more. Either way, yikes - feels like Tempurpedic (ie not good)! So on to the topper config tonite. I assume you would still prefer I keep the medium dunlop rather than medium talalay as the bottom layer? I'd rather use Talalay just because that would give us both only 1 Dunlop per side (so the height will match) but I suspect its better to try dunlop first? Steve |
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The back pain from misalignment can take a while to develop so when you first lay on something that is good for pressure relief it can feel good but after a while or through the course of the night your back can start to complain. That's why it's usually best to use the thinnest comfort layers that works for someone ... especially if weight distribution creates a tendency for the hips to sink in much more than the shoulders. This is where a differential construction can be better as well because the firmer middle layer stops the sinking down of the hips better but it may need more comfort thickness or softness so the shoulders can sink in enough. I think this is why so many people find their mattress different from the store once they've slept on it the whole night as well because in the store they may not spend enough time for misalignment issues to create any pain or discomfort. With memory foam it can be from actually sinking in deeper over the night but not so much with latex. I'd probably try the two dunlop layers first and if that seems to work then to test the Talalay to see if the difference causes any issues. On the bottom ... and depending on the actual difference in ILD between them and how deeply you are sinking into the bottom layer (percentage compression) ... a medium Talalay could work OK as well. If the bottom layer is softer than the middle there will also be a little "pre-compression" just from the weight of what is above it. Phoenix |
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So I was just laying in bed thinking "well, this still isn't right" and trying to figure out if its now too hard (because of the new firm dunlop) or too soft (because of the new 1" soft talalar topper). Maybe both? Laying on my back feels a lot like when I tested 3-6" of foam on the ground. There is some give (maybe too much under my hips) but then it feels like I bottom out. Very firm where its compressed. On my side I feel like I am making a V at the waist. Also feel more pressure on my ribs then before. Feels like my shoulder needs to sink in more but my ribs need to sink in less? Not sure if this is a sign of too hard or too soft. But I think for now I will swap the 2 dunlops and go back to a more normal progressive approach (fim on bottom, medium in the middle, soft on top) and see how that works. I thought 4" of soft on top would be too soft but maybe not... Steve |
| Hey Steve, been reading this thread and wanted to see if you have any update. |
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peclark wrote: Hey Steve, been reading this thread and wanted to see if you have any update. Steve |
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Steve, could you tell me what the ILD of the talalay and dunlop layers are? 4" of talalay over 6" of dunlop is similar to Natura eco brilliance which I liked in the store. I have some dunlop layers I am trying and just can't seem to find right combo. I have chronic lower back pain and think I need really firm. Last night I tried two 3" layers of 36 ILD dunlop over a 5" extra firm poly (using only temporarily) and it was obviously very firm. In morning my lower back felt pretty good buy middle/upper back was sore. Hard to find that just right combo where either lower or upper back isn't sore in morning. I have never tested with talalay yet. I also have a 2"19 ILD dunlop and 3" 31 dunlop I am working with. I sleep just find on my couch which is about 4+ inches of very firm foam over springs. I tend to think that you should know after one night if combo is working but maybe you do have to have a period of adjustment? I just know that when I sleep in some hotels with good mattress that I feel great in morning....but that may be plecebo effect too. Thanks |
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peclark wrote:
Steve, could you tell me what the ILD of the talalay and dunlop layers are? 4" of talalay over 6" of dunlop is similar to Natura eco brilliance which I liked in the store. I have some dunlop layers I am trying and just can't seem to find right combo. I have chronic lower back pain and think I need really firm. Last night I tried two 3" layers of 36 ILD dunlop over a 5" extra firm poly (using only temporarily) and it was obviously very firm. In morning my lower back felt pretty good buy middle/upper back was sore. Hard to find that just right combo where either lower or upper back isn't sore in morning. I have never tested with talalay yet. I also have a 2"19 ILD dunlop and 3" 31 dunlop I am working with. I sleep just find on my couch which is about 4+ inches of very firm foam over springs. I tend to think that you should know after one night if combo is working but maybe you do have to have a period of adjustment? I just know that when I sleep in some hotels with good mattress that I feel great in morning....but that may be plecebo effect too. Thanks Yes I think it usually takes a few days to know how good or bad a bed really is. Less if its just really terrible for you. More if its close. I've had configs I liked a lot at first that caused bad back problems after a few nights. So yes you should give each config time (like a few nights unless its obviously no good). One thing Phoenix preached was eliminating layers when testing. So you could try just 1 36ild layer on the extra firm base instead of 2. If you think thats too firm try the 31ild for a few nights. You didn't give weight and sleep positions (I'm guessing stomach?) but 8" of firm foam is probably enough for most people. Good luck. PS - this thread is so long and old that I think a lot of other people might not look at it anymore :-) You might do better starting a new thread... This message was modified Jan 30, 2011 by st3v3k4hn
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