12 year latex veteran with a question
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Hello All. Let me first say that this is a wonderful site and I'm really impressed with not only the wonderful information being shared here but also the civility in which it is being communicated. <BR>I bought my first (and only) latex mattress 12 1/2 years ago and it is still the mattress that I use to this day. When I bought it at Mattress Giant back in 1997, latex mattresses were just starting<BR>to come onto the market. It was the only latex model that they had and when I laid down on it, I knew that I needed to purchase it. It is a 6 inch natural latex mattress made by Associated Sleep Industries.<BR><BR>I've been so pleased with this mattress for so long, that I've been out of the loop of what's out there, as far as latex mattresses go. Coming to this site has been quite an eye opener as far as all the options that now<BR>exist, it's quite dizzying. The reason for my post is that my current mattress is starting to get a bit of a dip in its center and I think it may be time for a new latex mattress. Ideally, I'd like to get the same mattress<BR>that I have but it's no longer available. I don't know what firmness my mattress is or if it is dunlop or talalay. About all I know is that it is very heavy and there are no other materials interwoven (i.e. cotton, wool,<BR>synthetic latex, PU foam, memory foam) into the mattress. It's just a 6 inch slab of natural latex with a mattress cover sewn around it. <BR><BR>I've read quite a few posts on this forum about folks building their own latex mattresses with different layers of latex of varying firmness. I'd like to keep my next purchase simple and just replace what I already<BR>have with it's present day equivalent. For those in the know, would the Foam By Mail 6 inch latex mattress fit the bill? Is their mattress 100 % natural latex with nothing added? I'm open to any comments or <BR>suggestions about FBM or any other manufacturers. Thank you so much for your help.<BR><BR>Jay This message was modified Sep 16, 2009 by enlighten
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Re: 12 year latex veteran with a question
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eagle2 wrote: <span style="font-weight: bold;">Jay:</span> It would be wonderful if someone like "Consumer Reports" would get their head out of the sand and really do a scientific study on mattresses. They won't do it, they just don't want to spend the time and money. But I believe that's what it would take to really be able to answer a lot of the questions that people have about latex.<BR><BR>I have heard that both Dunlop and Talalay 100% natural latex are both wonderful products. Dunlop uses the older method of pure vulcanizeing of the latex and Talalay uses a more complicated process in an effort to get a more consistent product. But if both processes use 100% natural organic latex, then they should both last for a very long time.<BR><BR>Basically, it seems to me, that you can hear anything you want to based upon the individuals bias or prejudice for one type of latex foam over another. Some people are convinced that a blended latex with synthetic latex mixed with natural latex is the best product. For instance Latex International, one of the largest manufacturers of Talalay latex in the world, and manufactured right here in America, has a 65 synthetic 35 natural blend that some people swear by. And since they make an all natural product as well, it can become quite confusing.<BR><BR>But just guessing, and that's all I'm doing is guessing, I would guess that the all natural product, both Dunlop and Talalay, would be the most durable product, and the better product. But I am simply guessing. Like you I would love to know, but until someone who does this kind of testing scientifically tests both Dunlop and Talalay method of manufacturing latex alongside the blended product, we're going to all just keep guessing.<BR><BR>Like you I am a larger male at 6' 2" and 210 pounds (side sleeper). And I just purchased an all natural latex mattress. Since I am 72 years of age I doubt that I will live long enough to really test out the longevity characteristics of the mattress since they are reputed to have 15 to 30 year life expectancies. <BR><BR>And so it goes! Good luck in your quest. All great points eagle, there are so many variables in all of this. Let me ask you, since we are both about the same size, what firmness(es) did you get with your current latex mattress? And......let's hope you live a long, healthy life. Thank you again, Jay |
Re: 12 year latex veteran with a question
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jimsocal wrote: My guess is that latex would probably be good if you could turn it over... but that would require surgery...<BR><BR>I think you definitely should try to find out what ILD it is, especially if you've really liked it because if you get a different ILD you may not be happy. ILD can usually be guessed pretty easily -within a few digits - by a latex expert or one who deals in latex. Is there a latex seller anywhere near you? <BR><BR>Even if you just cut into the bottom corner of the mattress, with an exacto knife, you could take a piece out (cut with a $10 electric carving knife) and use that sample to find out what ILD it is. Then, once it's covered with a sheet, no one will feel or see the surgery scar. That's what I'd do, but then I'm a mattress surgeon. Jim, I'm intrigued by your point about the latex being good if it were turned over but I'm completely new to the idea of surgery. I wish you were closer by. If I were to be able to take a photo of the inside of my mattress would you be able to tell what the ILD is? Many thanks. |
Re: 12 year latex veteran with a question
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cloud9 wrote: Speculation on exactly how long latex will last aside, my entire family slept on blended Dunlop latex mattresses and they lasted 20 years before the foam began to dry up and powder. That's not speculation--that's fact. Unfortunately I don't think it's possible to find blended Dunlop any longer. It's all "natural" which means it's derived from rubber trees rather than petroleum. </p><p>Eagle is quite right. You really can't get a straight answer on what kind of latex is the most durable and long lasting. It seems like whatever the vendor sells is the "best." But it does make sense to me that sap is like wine--a natural product whose quality will vary from harvest to harvest. The theory behind blended latex is that the quality of the synthetic element can be maintained to a specific standard, and will compensate for any deficiency in the natural element. I don't know if there is really any truth to it, I just know my blended Dunlop mattress lasted a really long time. Thank you for that wise and broad view. It's really difficult given that a lot of the companies that people are going with are mail order. We can't really try the mattresses until we have already purchased them. That is why this site is so helpful, real people, giving real feedback from their own experience. |
Re: 12 year latex veteran with a question
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Jay: Have you gone here? http://www.habitatfutons.com/latex_mattress.html They have some of the best explanatory video's regarding latex I have seen. They are also the company with the super simple purchasing program. Pick one of three types of mattresses and you are all done. If you do not like it there is no exchange but, there is a 6 mo. trial period, and if you do not like it you can return it for a full refund no questions ask. It seems to me like a good deal if all you want is a replacement for your old mattress and do not want to, "Wade In The Water" so to speak. This mattress business can drive you crazy. I have spent the last two mo. going over this stuff on an almost 24/7 bases. It gets old!!!  But I do like more control, sooooo! I am paying for it. I believe my FloBed product will work for me however. I am going firm at first as Talalay is a softer foam than Dunlop. One side is med, over firm, over extra firm. The other is, firm, over extra firm, over extra firm. This will give me something to experment with. Hopefully I will not need to exchange cores at all. If I do, hopefully, it will be a minimal exchange procedure. I was always going to call Habitat to see if I could not find out more about what the ILD of the two different layers were. I did not do so, so I do not know. I would recommend calling them and trying to get some additional information. While they have no exchange policy, their return policy is the best in the business, and their prices are very good, some of the best around. PS: I just decided to go ahead and call habitat and see what their core layers were. They are as follows. Their 6 inch Dunlop is there least expensive mattress, it is 26 ILD. Next, the same 6 inch Dunlop with a 2 inch Talalay, this Talalay is 19 ILD. The third mattress is the same ILD's the only difference is the top layer is 3 inches of Talalay instead of two. They all come glued together inside a mattress cover with all the air sucked out of them for shipping, so you simply unpackage them, unfold them, and give it about an hour to become a bed, and you're ready to go. That's it. Jay: My guess is that Habitat's approach might be to soft for us. This is a very soft mattress it seems to me. However, although ILD should be the same for Dunlop as well as Talalay, Dunlop has always felt different to me, more firm, less "springey" than Talalay. So who knows? I would just have to sleep on it to find out for sure. Boy, with their most costly mattress it sure is going to give a sleeper a sinking feeling, with 3" of 19 ILD Talalay! The only thing I can say is, if their approach to betting for the "average person" is correct, then one of two things is going to happen. Either I'm not average or, the bed that I have ordered is going to feel like concrete! It is obvious that Habitat has taken the minimalist approach to latex mattresses. They looked around the Internet and decided they wanted no part of exchanging cores and other "foolishness" when it came to ILD. So they did some testing and decided that this selected mattress ILB was going to appeal to the vast majority. While they do not have a one-size-fits-all, they do have a three sizes fits all. And those sizes all have the same ILB. But their prices are very good, and their return policy is excellent, probably the best in the industry. This message was modified Sep 18, 2009 by eagle2
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Re: 12 year latex veteran with a question
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enlighten wrote: Jim, I'm intrigued by your point about the latex being good if it were turned over but I'm completely new to the idea of surgery. I wish you were closer by. If I were to be able to take a photo of the inside of my mattress would you be able to tell what the ILD is? Many thanks. One cannot tell an ILD from looking at it, one has to feel it. Even then, it takes someone very familiar with latex. I could guess but might be off by as much as 5 ILD which is too much. An expert could probably guess it within 1-2 ILD, I am guessing. As to mattress surgery, unless you really need to keep the mattress what have you got to lose? My first surgery was on a Sealy. I had no idea if I would end up with anything usable or not. I just got out an exacto knife and cut into it, guessing how to do it. Turned out it was easy as pie and was very usable. I suspect MOST mattresses can be cut into. I just re-read your 1st post and I am confused: Can't you just turn it over and use the other side, as is? If you've been using one side the whole time, the other side probably does not have a dip and would be just fine. What would prevent you from doing that? If you can't do that for some reason, or if both sides have a dip then the thing you'd need to do would be to haul the whole thing into a foam store where they cut their own foam and have them take it out of the cover and cut off the top 1" or so, to get rid of the dip. I wish you were here in L.A.. I know a couple places that I THINK could do that for you for probably under $50. Then you'd just put the cover back on, or buy a new cover for it (many places sell covers for foam cores). The thing is, if I had the perfect ILD and type of latex and only needed to fix the dip, I'd try to do that instead of buying a new one. Not JUST for the money, but for the comfort. See if you can find a foam cutting place - foam store or foam distributor for the furniture industry. Then call them and explain that you just want to cut off about an inch of latex off the top, completely level to sleep on. Otherwise, again, just cut into it as best you can ; I'd say start at the bottom corner with an exacto knife or sharp scissors and pull back a piece of the cloth and see what's going on in there, then proceed. If it's just a cover, it should come off real easily. It might just be "stuck" to the latex from years of use. Pull it off, and you can buy a new one if need be, for $100 or less, or just use a fitted sheet over it and leave the bottom uncovered, no big deal since it's old anyway. You MAY indeed NEED a new piece of latex, but I'd try a) turning it over and b) cutting off an inch or so off the top, first, before investing $500-1000 on a new one. Then, if need be you can cut a 6" square off and send it to someone like foambymail to tell you what type and ILD it is. This message was modified Sep 18, 2009 by jimsocal
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Re: 12 year latex veteran with a question
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<BR><SPAN CLASS="quotedmessageheader">eagle2 wrote:</SPAN><BR><DIV CLASS="quotedmessage">&lt;span style=&quot;font-weight: bold;&quot;&gt;Jay&lt;/span&gt;: Have you gone here? http://www.habitatfutons.com/latex_mattress.html&lt;BR&gt;&lt;BR&gt;They have some of the best explanatory video's regarding latex I have seen..........This mattress business can drive you crazy. I have spent the last two mo. going over this stuff on an almost 24/7 bases. It gets old!!!<BR><BR>I <BR><BR>I will definitely check out Habitat eagle, I'm playing Mr. Mom for my 5 month old son today so as soon as he goes down<BR>for a nap, I will take a look. Yes you are right, this mattress stuff can make you bonkers.<BR><BR>Since you've created your own hybrid, I'm curious to hear your feedback about which side of your mattress that you prefer. Is it firm <BR>enough, too firm, etc. I'm trying to gauge what firmness would suit my needs as I look into purchasing a new mattress.<BR><BR>Thanks eagle. <BR> This message was modified Sep 19, 2009 by enlighten
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Re: 12 year latex veteran with a question
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jimsocal wrote: <BR><BR>I just re-read your 1st post and I am confused: Can't you just turn it over and use the other side, as is? If you've been using one side the whole time, the other side probably does not have a dip and would be just fine.<BR><BR>What would prevent you from doing that?<BR><BR>If you can't do that for some reason, or if both sides have a dip then the thing you'd need to do would be to haul the whole thing into a foam store where they cut their own foam and have them take it out of the cover and cut off the top 1" or so, to get rid of the dip. I wish you were here in L.A.. I know a couple places that I THINK could do that for you for probably under $50. Then you'd just put the cover back on, or buy a new cover for it (many places sell covers for foam cores).<BR><BR>The thing is, if I had the perfect ILD and type of latex and only needed to fix the dip, I'd try to do that instead of buying a new one. Not JUST for the money, but for the comfort. See if you can find a foam cutting place - foam store or foam distributor for the furniture industry. Then call them and explain that you just want to cut off about an inch of latex off the top, completely level to sleep on.<BR><BR>Otherwise, again, just cut into it as best you can ; I'd say start at the bottom corner with an exacto knife or sharp scissors and pull back a piece of the cloth and see what's going on in there, then proceed. If it's just a cover, it should come off real easily. It might just be "stuck" to the latex from years of use. Pull it off, and you can buy a new one if need be, for $100 or less, or just use a fitted sheet over it and leave the bottom uncovered, no big deal since it's old anyway. You MAY indeed NEED a new piece of latex, but I'd try a) turning it over and b) cutting off an inch or so off the top, first, before investing $500-1000 on a new one.<BR><BR>Then, if need be you can cut a 6" square off and send it to someone like foambymail to tell you what type and ILD it is.<br type="_moz"/> Hi Jim. I've actually been treating my latex mattress like a regular spring coil mattress since I bought it, I've been flipping and rotating it every six months. I love you advice about replacing the compromised latex in my mattress, I had no idea that you could do that. There is a foam store here in Boston that I know of but I'm not sure how good they are. I've called a few times inquiring about having them build me a mattress. I've spoken to an older woman who runs the place and she didn't seem too friendly. Thank you again for all the sage advice. |