Essentia
| I'm new here. I've spent a few hours poking around but haven't found any information on the mattress I'm considering: the Classic 8 by a company called Essentia (www.myessentia.com). They are a Canadian company that makes what is billed as the world's only natural memory foam. Has anyone heard of them? Thanks for taking the time to answer. -Michelle |
Re: Essentia
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budgy wrote: im in the sales aspect of it but deal with companies that have something called 3rd party certification. yes it is technically impossible to have 100% natural latex foam because there will always be residual vulcanizing agents and soaps. however when something is certified 100% natural they are talking about the polymer content of the material. the ratio of NR to SBR, this is why I ask about your styrene butadiene content. I have actually seen the test sheets by Eco Institut of other latex foamers listing the polymer content, one of which I even posted on this site in another thread. Adding styrene butadiene is hardly necessary and does reduce the natural content. if you feel you are not being misleading by calling your product all natural when it is not as "all natural" as possible that is your decision to market the product as being so. if your argument is solely going to consist of declaring the obvious differences in pointing out that I am in sales and you are on the manufacturing end but not back up anything with facts then your point is really quite invalid. I am asking legitimate questions. And I am not so naive to believe every ones claim on 100% natural....precisely why I am questioning you all the same as any other person who has tried to sell me something they thought was natural but really isn't. hello budgy: what do u think of latex mattress from Costco that some bought? is it any good for people with low back pain. This message was modified Jan 27, 2010 by lowbacpain
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Re: Essentia
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Our findings are based on some european eco certified latex foamers that we have worked with first hand in their labs and directly on their foaming departments, and know their content and certifications. We cannot comment on any other foamers since we have not worked directly with their product, which is the only true certification for us. Our disclosures are intended for in depth information and not a sales pitch. We would simply say 100% natural (like everyone else does), and not actually disclose that it is not all natural. |
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I appreciate the list nonetheless. But listing an ingredients list doesn't really tell us the quantities of anything either. Which in the interest of full transparency and disclosure the amounts of those materials to some people (you can read all the other threads on this website and see that people are concerned greatly about the actual content) would be considered vital to back up your claims. Kind of like how when a company says their latex is blended, lets say they claim 30% Natural content and 70% synthetic. They are usually referring to the polymer content, because of residual agents left in the foam I agree that even saying the product 30% natural is some what off the mark, in reality it could be 20~25% natural. Really kind of hard to tell without actually testing the product thoroughly, which no consumer has the ability to do. But at least in this scenario we do know the ratio of the polymer content which is probably the most important aspect. What is the actual polymer content in your 'natural latex' cores, and your 'natural memory foam' top layers? ie; how much actual Styrene Butadiene is used vs natural rubber content? Because in contradiction to your last post you mention in several place on your website that your latex cores are 100% natural and yet list styrene butadiene as a component as well. |
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Quantities is something you won’t find latex foamers disclosing as it’s the secret to their formulation. This is why there are only a handful or so of us worldwide. To label latex foam as 100% natural you need to have more than 85% natural content in your foam, which both our natural Dunlop latex and our natural memory foam do. Let me know if anything. |
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here is the beautiful thing about 3rd party certification. http://greensleep.ca/pdf/rubber.pdf this is an actual test sheet proving in this particular suppliers latex foam sample that there is zero styrene butadiene content. and that based on their criteria for something to get certified as natural rubber would have to be less than 5% filler and 5% styrene butadiene. in other words at least 90% puritiy, although in this case this company is really somewhere around 95%. There is no 'secret' to the formula any of these companies use, they all use the same basic stabilization chemicals during transport (ammonia, sometimes naturally derived), and vulcanizing agents (ash, and zinc oxide). This company fits my description of 100% natural rubber, primarily the absence of styrene butadiene, pending residual foaming agents this is the purest possible rubber you can get. Please don't tell me you meant that there are only a handful of latex foam makers in the world in any literal way? If by handful you mean like a dozen handfuls or more then sure, I agree with you. |
Re: Essentia
| Hi All, Just want to let Mich know that I did get a chance to try the Essenia mattress at a Costco in Canada ... and while it was priced well ... I found it uncomfortable. At 6'5" and 210 lbs, I hit the bottom when sitting down into it and it didn't provide me with any support. My wife liked it ... but it wasn't a good choice for me. Of course, everyone needs to try a mattress and it is a very individualistic decision but it just didn't work for me. Too bad, I remember waiting until it came to the Costco closest to me and excited about trying it out. Here is a listing from Google.com when I typed in Essentia and Costco ... to back up my efforts. http://www.myessentia.com/blog/tag/memory-foam/ |
Re: Essentia
| Mitch, if the Essentia mattress is a viable choice for you based on your location, you might want to see what firmnesses they offer before you reject it out of hand. The mattress you tried was undoubtably too soft. You probably need a much firmer latex, and perhaps Essentia makes their mattresses in firmer variations. I know I am tall and heavy, and my latex mattress is very firm - about 9" of 36 ILD with a 2" soft convoluted topper. I do not bottom out on this mattress, and get the proper comfort and support. |
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Budgy Don't forget, third party certification is on the final product. It does not tell you the quantities of liquids used to make it. This is where companies mislead everyone. If it was all measurable you would be able to know the exact formulation of everything. No more secret recipes ;-) If you're referring to tires, latex gloves etc...then yes there are many more latex manufacturers. When it comes to mattress latex foam there are only a handful or so of us worldwide. Many, many resellers..asian...indian.. pretending to be manufacturers btw. Jazzsinger777 We had 2 products at Costco. 1) Our Classic 8 (entirely natural) 2) PureFoam (not entirely natural) Today all Essentia models are natural, solely made from natural Dulop latex and our natural memory foam. |
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yes I realize that we only know the final residuals, but if there was any styrene butadiene used in the making of it, it would show up on the testing of the final product, it is the content of the final product that I am interested in the most anyway as a salesperson myself. and no, I am not talking about tire manufacturers and latex glove makers, if we throw those into the mix the number jumps much much higher. There are atleast 15 or 20 certified latex foam makers in SE Asia alone, and quite a few others that make some very questionable product. I am sorry but I really don't see how they could be posing as manufacturers simply 're-selling' the product , if you have ever been to India and tried to buy a latex mattress you would realize how dirt cheap they are over there, no way that they are buying them from the US or a European maker and selling them for what they are worth in that marketplace, granted they also don't use nice coverings over there, but still, very cheap). Why would anyone buy from a re-seller located in China that would have to re-sell the product for more than the original manfucturer would have to charge in order to make a product when they can purchase it direct? It's cheaper to buy it from China because they are probably in most cases cutting corners on the product, and also saving on the labour costs, especially if they are located a lot closer to the plantations, they are probably saving a lot on shipping costs as well. There are about a handful of makers that are currently making latex foam in North America as well. Foamex, Carpenter, LatexCo, Latex International, Sealy also makes their own latex (100% synthetic though to my knowledge), and apparently you guys, this is just the ones that I know of personally. |
Re: Essentia
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I think I should take the time to say something positive here though, because I feel like I might be being a little too hard on you guys. I think you make a really interesting product. I actually watched one of the owners on Dragon's Den a while back, I know you guys are definitely hoping to open a bunch of Essentia only stores (not sure if this is still the plan), because you were thinking maybe normal retailers wouldn't want to carry the product because you are saying it is a healthy alternative to some of the potentially dangerous chemicals found in standard mattresses. I personally think if the product stands on its own merits that it could do just fine. This is actually precisely what I do, I carry a range of 'normal' cookie cutter types of mattresses, as well as a very large selection of healthier alternatives. I flat out tell people about the off-gasing issues with standard mattresses, sometimes I think it hurts our sales temporarily, but our integrity remains intact and in the process we will probably convince a fair number of people to spend a little more money on a much better mattress. And at the risk of giving away what makes us successful I know that us actually carrying the standard well known brands only reinforces the truth in what I tell peoeple about the product. If I was a natural beds only store, and didn't carry any of the major brands I would most certainly come across as being biased. I simply provide truth and options, most of the smarter people that come in can see this. I do think it is somewhat misleading to say the product is all natural if you are using styrene butadiene, however you do have a completely unique breed of memory foam so for all I know maybe it was a necessary step to get to those properties. I don't consider it a bad thing, I think its a great thing because you are probably making the cleanest memory foam type of material around, and you are giving people an option in that type of feel that is genuinely healthier. Plus its really great to see a Canadian company doing something like this. But as we can see here even from the first couple of pages (outside of my own responses) that there is a lot of confusion and skepticism when people first see this product, and this is from the kind of customers that clearly do more research than the average mattress buyer. I personally think that if the product was even just called the "cleanest" or "most natural" or "naturally derived" memory foam would just sound a lot more accurate and you might have some stores interested in carrying your product based on that info. This message was modified Jan 28, 2010 by budgy
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