Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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Firstly, I'd like to thank everyone who has kindly contributed their input in my previous threads. I've learned quite a bit about mattresses and toppers, what to look for and what to avoid, and I'm certain that right now I'd be 100% happy with my mattress if only I'd heeded *all* of the sage advice I've been given (but sometimes you just have to forge ahead stubbornly and make your own mistakes, none of which I plan to ever repeat). The OMF mattress that felt absolutely perfect in the show room is now causing me grief, mainly in the form of lower back aches. To those of you enamored of the convenience of purchasing an innerspring mattress that feels great in the store, here's what I've learned: if you suffer from any back issues whatsoever, get the firmest model possible with the least amount of PU foam, then craft your own comfort layer using toppers. Or have your bed custom-made by a local mattress maker (this will be the method by which I acquire my next mattress, I hope). I don't care how fabulously comfortable, supportive, etc., that mattress seems during the "test drive", it is not going to feel the same after sleeping on it for several hours. So now I am planning to exchange my orthopedic ultra plush for either the ortho ultra firm or the ortho extra firm (I haven't tried the ultra firm yet, but both have only 1" of PU padding), and I will need toppers to make it comfy. At this point I'm torn between talalay blended toppers and memory foam, or possibly a combination of both. I need good lower back support, but I crave that "pillow top" feel, so I'm uncertain as to how to best approach this issue. I've had memory foam toppers in the past and loved them, so I thought I might do well with either 2" of Sensus foam, or a layer of "cushion firm" latex and 1" of either Sensus memory foam or 1" of soft latex. I'm a side sleeper, so I don't know if a 2" comfort layer will be enough, but I'm more than willing to start with that and go from there. So what do you think? 2" of Sensus, or a latex/Sensus combo, or a medium latex/soft latex combo? A combo I haven't thought of? I'm going for softness *and* support here, which I know is a tricky combination to pull off. Any advice welcome! |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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Zzzzzzzspleaze wrote: An update on the continuing mattress saga: I received blended talalay latex samples from sleeplikeabear.com in 32, 28, and 19 ILD. The 32 feels just like its "cushion firm" description, it is firm with plenty of give. The 28 feels very jello-y, it strikes a perfect balance between softness and firmness. The 19 feels like springy, rubbery memory foam, though it does not perform the same. ...... Thanks for posting that. I thought about asking for samples from SleepLikeABear; maybe I still will. When I tried out a couple of latex mattresses in the stores (the Prana mattresses at City Mattress, and a latex mattress at Genesee Mattress), they felt great. But that's for a few minutes, and it's hard to guess what just a topper will feel like. (I didn't want to spend the big bucks to get a full latex mattress, and I wasn't up to trying the Flobeds/SleepEz/FBM DIY mattress-building at this point.) Last night was my 2nd night on my new mattress -- an extra firm, flippable innerspring mattress (660 Lura-flex coils, 14.5 gauge, with extra layers of the Novabond fiber mats that go directly over the coils). According to the notes I scribbled in the store, there's 3/4" of 1.5 (density?) foam, flat. Genesee Mattress, where I bought this, is owned by Jamestown Mattress, in Jamestown, NY, so all the mattresses they sell are made by Jamestown. I was glad to find that Jamestown still makes the old-fashioned double-sided innerspring mattresses, along with a few other types. I was afraid I was going to have to drive to Pittsburgh (5 hours away) or Cleveland (4.5 hours away) to try out the OMF mattresses before ordering. (Wonder what the delivery charge would have been.) Zzzzzzspleaze, I understand how you wound up with that plush mattress. I almost bought something similar at Genesee Mattress, even though I went in there resolving to get a minimally padded one. The cushier ones just feel sooooooo nice when you try them out for a few minutes at the store; they are *very* tempting. (My 18-year-old mattress was so shot, I could feel the coils beneath me.) But I was really afraid of having the cushier mattress compress too soon, so I managed to stick with my original plan. I'm glad you will be able to exchange your mattress for a less-padded one. But back to toppers: First night on my new mattress, I tried it with just a fairly cushy mattress pad (no toppers). My back and hips felt fine, but my shoulders felt a little crunched. Last night I added an old polyfill fiber-bed -- I think that's what it is, but it's about an inch thick, so I'm not sure if that makes it a really thin fiber-bed or a really thick mattress pad. (Laura Ashley brand, bought a few years ago on sale at Kohl's, I think. Fairly cheap. Looks like the polyfill got a little bunched up in the wash, within in each quilted square.) I put my cushy mattress pad on top of that. That setup was more comfortable for my shoulders. Hips seemed fine this morning; but there's a little bit of low back pain. I'll keep testing this setup for a while, though; I don't want to judge by just one night, especially since I stayed in bed till almost 9 this morning. (Saturday, and ooooh, ahhhh, no more coils digging into me!) I had emailed SleepLikeABear before my new mattress arrived, and asked what latex topper they might recommend for an extra-firm innerspring mattress and a side sleeper who's about 5'6", 120 pounds. The reply was "Based on the information you have provided us, we would like to recommend our 2" 19 ILD latex topper." But based on what I've read here in the forum (and because of prices), I'd be more inclined to try a 1" topper, before going to 2", if I need to go that route. (I'm not interested in memory foam; if I need a topper, I'll probably stick with latex or a fiber-bed.) (And with all this typing, I think I have not added a single helpful thing to your thread! D'oh!) I will be very interested to find out what you end up with. Thanks for the info you have posted. -Catherine PS: Last337, I think that Cuddle Bed is a brand of fiber-bed. |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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Marybeth, glad the fiberbed topper is working for you. Sounds similar to mine. I am sleeping quite well these days...the foam inside my bed MUST be HD, took 8 months to get softer! The fiberbed topper is just the ticket for my shoulder area. That and a nice down pillow to adjust to my perfect neck position and I'm good to go. I sometimes wake up in the am and haven't moved an inch all night. YAY for feeling good! Kait |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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Zzzzzzzspleaze wrote: I need good lower back support, but I crave that "pillow top" feel, so I'm uncertain as to how to best approach this issue. I've had memory foam toppers in the past and loved them, so I thought I might do well with either 2" of Sensus foam, or a layer of "cushion firm" latex and 1" of either Sensus memory foam or 1" of soft latex. I'm a side sleeper, so I don't know if a 2" comfort layer will be enough, but I'm more than willing to start with that and go from there. So what do you think? 2" of Sensus, or a latex/Sensus combo, or a medium latex/soft latex combo? A combo I haven't thought of? I'm going for softness *and* support here, which I know is a tricky combination to pull off. Zzzzzzspleaze, have you decided what kind of topper (or topper combo) to get? Or are you still trying to figure that out? (Did you say elsewhere that you didn't like the latex?) I'm pondering various possibilities (and I've read and reread and reread bunches of threads here). I have a new (6 weeks ago), firm, minimally padded innerspring mattress (flippable, 9" total depth), with a 1" 24 ILD Talatech topper from SleepLikeaBear, and a light fiberbed on top of that. My hips & back are pretty happy; my shoulders are not. (Side sleeper, mostly -- though wondering how hard it would be to train myself to sleep on my back; it would really simplify things.) Tried removing the fiberbed for a night; put it back on this morning 'cause my shoulders hurt quite a bit. Before I remade the bed, I lay on it with just the topper on, to see if I'm bottoming out on the 1" 24 ILD. My hips are not; I think my shoulders are. I don't think I need something softer (like 19 ILD); I think I just need more cushioning in general -- just a little more stuff for my shoulders to sink into. (I'm 5'6", 120 pounds.) So now I'm considering adding another 1" topper (either 24 ILD or 28 or 32 ILD; I don't want to lose back/hip support) or adding the 1" Sensus memory foam topper (relatively inexpensive at Overstock). (Foamorder.com also has 5.3 lb density memory foam, available in 1" depths & upward.) I said before that I don't want memory foam, and I still don't like the idea of dealing with the off-gassing, but a lot of people seem to like the Sensus foam or the combo of latex and memory foam. So I dunno. (Didn't care for the Dunlop latex, as far as I could tell from the small samples I got from Sleepwarehouse.) Pardon me for piggybacking on your thread, but it seemed silly to start yet another thread on picking the right topper.  - Catherine This message was modified Sep 18, 2009 by Catherine
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Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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Catherine, Good luck with finding the right combination. I too am struggling with finding the perfect toppers for my springs. Thought I'd give you this promotion code for overstock.com I got in the mail - I assume it will work for anyone who uses it: 144454 I do like the Sensus and I think it's always better to buy 1" and then add another 1" if needed. I made the mistake of buying the 2" and it's just too much for me. Wish I'd have bought 2 x 1". One thing you might try which I have had some success with is to put the memory foam UNDER the latex or under some other kind of fiber or cushioning. That way you don't sink into it too much, which is what I usually have a problem with. Probably most people WANT to sink into it, which is how it's designed. But sinking in sometimes makes my arm go numb (due to a nerve issue I have at my shoulder/neck). |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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Jimsocal, thank you for the Overstock code and the other info. I've been following your posts closely, among others. This forum has been such a big help. My main reservations about memory foam (besides the off-gassing) are the same ones that other people have mentioned: I don't want to sink into a crater or get too hot. (I've seen a few reports online that even the Foamex Aerus foam sleeps hot, and it's supposed to be cooler than other types.) From what I've read here, I'm figuring that I can't crater too much in an inch of foam, nor would that provide too much heat, especially if it's under either the latex or under just the fiberbed. I looked again at FoamOrder.com's Web site. They also have a promotional code -- recession09 -- for anything on their toppers page (http://www.foamorder.com/foam-toppers.html). Looks like that includes their Dunlop and memory foam toppers. (Does not include anything on the Clearance page.) Prices for memory foam toppers look pretty reasonable. They kind of diss their own products, though, in a way (talking about all the chemicals in memory foam, and pushing the Dunlop latex), so that's a bit odd. I don't want to spend a fortune on this stuff or spend oodles of time tweaking, but I'm willing to spend a little bit more, and tweak a little bit more. I'm still sleeping much more comfortably on this new mattress, with topper & fiberbed, than I was on my 18-year-old mattress, which was so shot that I could feel the coils beneath me. (But hey, I paid $300 for it, so I certainly got my money's worth; it was OK for about 15 years.) When I was testing my 1" 24 ILD topper this morning, before re-making the bed, did it occur to me to try folding it over to see how 2" of it would feel? No. Duh. (rolls eyes) Guess I'll have to do that at some point. -Catherine |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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Forgot to mention: FoamOrder.com offers a 90-day trial on their 5.3lb-density memory foam toppers. I've never done business with this company; no idea how good they are -- I'm just putting the info out there. -Catherine |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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Hi! I was just wondering... seems like a lot of folks (think most have been side sleepers?) have said that something works for their hips, but not their shoulders, or vice versa. So I was wondering if anyone's ever tried to make "zones" with different ILDs (or maybe even with memory foam vs latex)? I know some latex mattress places will say they "zone" the density within their mattress, but I was wondering if any of you have tried a similar idea with your DIY beds? In other words, just for example in your case, Catherine, cut the top third of your 1" 24 ILD latex topper off (where your shoulders and head would go), and (after having bought another 1" topper in something softer like the 1" 19 ILD latex topper you were thinking of, or a memory foam topper) do the same thing - cut a third of it off, and put it in place where the 1/3 24 ILD topper was removed, if that makes sense? I suppose that might create a lot of "waste" though... Potentially you could make pillow(s) or doggie beds (if you have the 4-legged furry friends) out of the "left overs"? Or actually, I think I saw on some of the sites that you can order a custom size - not sure if the cost would be comparable or if they'd charge a bunch for it being "custom cut"?? Forgive me if there's already been a gazillion posts with this idea! Been trying to read as much as I can! |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
Oh, and the obvious downside to not being able to return them then...  |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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mattressnewbie wrote: Hi! I was just wondering... seems like a lot of folks (think most have been side sleepers?) have said that something works for their hips, but not their shoulders, or vice versa. So I was wondering if anyone's ever tried to make "zones" with different ILDs (or maybe even with memory foam vs latex)? I know some latex mattress places will say they "zone" the density within their mattress, but I was wondering if any of you have tried a similar idea with your DIY beds? In other words, just for example in your case, Catherine, cut the top third of your 1" 24 ILD latex topper off (where your shoulders and head would go), and (after having bought another 1" topper in something softer like the 1" 19 ILD latex topper you were thinking of, or a memory foam topper) do the same thing - cut a third of it off, and put it in place where the 1/3 24 ILD topper was removed, if that makes sense? I suppose that might create a lot of "waste" though... Potentially you could make pillow(s) or doggie beds (if you have the 4-legged furry friends) out of the "left overs"? Or actually, I think I saw on some of the sites that you can order a custom size - not sure if the cost would be comparable or if they'd charge a bunch for it being "custom cut"?? Forgive me if there's already been a gazillion posts with this idea! Been trying to read as much as I can! Yeah, mattressnewbie, many of us here have been zoning. Not sure how many here currently are doing so. I experimented with zoning for a year or so and I have never come to any conclusions. Sometimes it seems to work for me and sometimes it does not. For me, I think the zoning has to be VERY subtle. If not, then it's like my body curls in all the wrong ways. So overall, yes, it can be good, but it has to be just right. That's my opinion. There used to be a guy here who was really into it and had like a bunch of soft foam for his shoulders. But that kind of extreme zoning never has worked well for me. I have a bunch of pieces of HR foam and latex and memory foam cut into thirds but mostly I don't use much zoning, at least not lately. |
Re: Need advice on how to best craft a comfort layer using toppers.
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mattressnewbie wrote: I was just wondering... seems like a lot of folks (think most have been side sleepers?) have said that something works for their hips, but not their shoulders, or vice versa. So I was wondering if anyone's ever tried to make "zones" with different ILDs (or maybe even with memory foam vs latex)? ... In other words, just for example in your case, Catherine, cut the top third of your 1" 24 ILD latex topper off (where your shoulders and head would go), and (after having bought another 1" topper in something softer...) do the same thing - cut a third of it off, and put it in place where the 1/3 24 ILD topper was removed, if that makes sense? Zoning probably works for some people, but I'd like to avoid that. For one thing, I don't think I could bring myself to slice up something I just forked over $132 for (my Talatech topper). For another, I prefer to channel my considerable OCD-ish tendencies in other directions.  My bed is pretty close to perfect now. When I got into bed last night -- extremely tired and sore after a weekend of intense physical labor (building a retaining wall on a steep hillside) -- it felt sooooo good. I think I need juuuust a little more cushioning, since my mattress is so minimally padded. I'm leaning toward 1 more inch of latex -- either 28 or 32 ILD, under my 24 ILD topper -- and if I do that, I'll stick with SleepLikeaBear. Their prices just went up a bit, unfortunately, but their products seem reliable (you know what you're getting) and their service is great. Still considering, at times, the 1" Sensus at Overstock -- it would be cheaper than the latex topper -- but I'm changing my mind about every 7 seconds or so. If I ever make up my mind and try another layer (of whatever), I'll report back on the results. I could be wrong, but as I said before, I don't think I need *softer* cushioning; I think I need *more* cushioning. Not a lot more -- just a teensy bit more, for my shoulders. Which, after the past two weekends of wielding a chainsaw, drill, and sledge hammer, might be a tad more muscular. -Catherine |